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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:34 am 
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This is an interesting question (to me at least) that hopefully someone out there will know.

It is regarding the entitlement of an ATS officer (or other branch officer) to wear the correct officers regimental badging in which they were assigned/attached too, if permitted / allowed by that particular regiment.

I know that in the different regiments usually the officers would have 'Bronze' regimental badging as opposed to the other ranks that usually had Brass etc. badging.

So if (as example) an ATS (or other) officer was attached to 'say' the Royal Signals would that officer have just worn the ‘general issue’ Brass & silver figure Signals badge or would they have been allowed to wear the Bronze equivalent officer badge? - after all they are an officer in their own right although they were not strictly part of that particular regiment - only an attached officer, would it have only been the 'official' Signals officers allowed to wear the Bronze badging?

Interesting question I thought? – any ideas?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:42 am 
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i believe they would only wear the badge of there parent regiment or corps for instace cooks/reme/etc always wore there own cap badge no matter what regiment or corps they were attached to this applies whatever the rank so far as i can remember in other words an ats officer attached to the signals would wear the ats cap badge certainly in one of my unit services reme officers wore there own cap badge in the 1970s, there may have been differences during and just after ww2 but i cant comment on that.

"Troops from other services, regiments or corps on attachment to units with distinctive coloured berets often wear the latter with their own cap badge. Colonels, brigadiers and generals usually continue to wear the beret of the regiment or corps to which they used to belong with the cap badge distinctive to their rank"

"Members of arms such as the Adjutant General's Corps and Royal Electrical and Mechanical Engineers serving on attachment to other units often wear that regiment's beret or headdress but with their own Corps cap badge."

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 13:51 pm 
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Dave - I understand that - (I think) but as only an 'attached officer' would they be entitled to wear the 'attached' regiments badge in 'officer Bronze' or only ' general issue Brass'

The ATS officers wore their own ATS collar dogs in 'Officer Bronze', but on the discretion from the commanding officer from the regiment to which they were attached they could wear 'that regiments' badge above their left breast tunic pocket - but would that particular badge be 'Bronze' or 'Brass' - or was it just what they could get hold of do you think?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 14:03 pm 
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what ever was the issue under regs at the time for the unit would be worn however do remember during ww2 many cap badges were plastic to save on brass and other metals

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 14:45 pm 
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I suppose there will be some regulations from that war time period that will not be able to be answered 100% due to;

1/ so long ago now with most people who would have known deceased
2/ regulations changed from that period, along with regulations for something like this buried deep somewhere never to see the light of day.

I suppose a lot was down to the commanding officer as to how much of a stickler he was.

Is it right of me to think though that an 'attached officer' would be afforded all the same positional rights as a regular officer of that regiment?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 14:55 pm 
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In theory yes within the constraints of seniority of promotion to the rank he held and would have mess rights and be entitled to salutes etc also would have to do orderly officer duties just as officers from the unit he was attached to would, depends what you mean by posistional rights really

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 15:01 pm 
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The thing is regulations have altered that many times since ww1 that unless you can state within a fairly small time frame then it is difficult to assume anything is correct or wrong and even then there may be cases where issues of different kit may not have caught up with a unit especially if it was in some god foresaken posting in the middle of nowhere. Also many old sweats would keep hold of older issue badges and kit to show that they were old hands in the unit.

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:37 am 
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The general hardship and difficulty in getting the 'correct' kit/badging in conflict especially in WW1 and WW2 is hard to appreciate nowadays I suppose and it seems like generally it was 'do the best you can' givn what you had.

I know there was the officer and men divide in WW1 & WW2 but I sometimes wonder just how wide that was? - and was it more prevalent in the different forces i.e. Army - Navy - Air force.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:54 am 
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The divide was and still is to a certain extent very wide the higher the officer rank the wider it was especially during the wars when most officers were either univercity, public school or silver spoon in mouth characters, different messes is a case in point with better food waiters and in ealier days batmen for the officers to do there washing, laundery, admin etc (no batmen now so they have lost that privledge) but the old saying is rank hath its privledges which just about says it all i guess

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:11 am 
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Thanks for all your input Dave - much appreciated, we will no doubt cross paths again when I need to know something else!

Merry Christmas

PS - you don't know anything about the special 21ins hand launched mini torpedo that the special operational guys had in WW2 do you?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:35 am 
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mate i dont sorry if you had asked me earlier i could have asked my dad but sadly he died sunday so loads of possible information gone im afraid

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:43 am 
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found on a web site i assume this wis hat you mean.

"Can anyone be so kind as to provide me with information about experimental mini-torpedoes used by British Commandos to carry special two-party operations during WW2? “Special Commando” by Rex Woods, published by William Kimber, London, deals about the wartime adventures of Lt-Col Robert Wilson, DSO and Bar. When Robert Wilson, then a Second-Lieutenant in the Royal Artillery, volunteered for the Commandos that were being formed little knew that as a foundation member of the Special Boat Section he, an Army officer, would be gone to war in a submarine, with a foldboat to carry him ashore and, with luck, back to the waiting submarine. By the middle of 1941 he operated along the coasts of Italy, Greece and North Africa. His daring feats brought him promotion to Captain and won him his first DSO. In September 1942 Wilson embarked on his tenth and last foldboat exploit, which earned him a Bar to his DSO, but also landed him in an Italian prisoner-of-war camp. I’m very interested in this operation because it took place in my geographical area. In the night between 5 an 6 September 1942 P42, later to be named Unbroken, under Lieutenant-Commander Alastair Mars, launched off Crotone, my town, a foldboat with Wilson and Bombardier Brittlebank aboard. They were able to enter the harbor for an attack on shipping with experimental mini-torpedoes. “Mini torpedo trial” is the chapter of Rex Wood’s book dealing with their mission in the foot of Italy (Crotone is on the Ionian coast of Calabria, just north of the Gulf of Squillace and south of Taranto). Likely this experimental attack went wrong because they didn’t hear the sound of the explosion after launching a mini-torpedo against the merchant ship moored in the harbor. Moreover there is no mention of an Italian ship attacked and damaged in the Crotone harbor in the Supermarina daily reports. Failed to make the rendezvous with the submarine, they paddled southwards along the coast hoping to reach Malta (!) but they were captured on the beach near Botricello, some ten miles south of Cape Rizzuto. I would like to get more information on experimental mini-torpedoes like the weapons tested by Wilson (technical details, pictures, successful operations, etc.)."

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:54 am 
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Dave - sorry to hear about 'dad' - I hope he was a good age? - another 'old soldier' gone I assume, getting less and less as the time goes on I'm afraid.

My partners dad is still alive at 93, he was in Burma in the Signals but his memory is going off a little now and is finding it a bit difficult to get things precise.

The mini torps sound the same and its the same info that I'd like - (technical details, pictures, successful operations, etc.) might even be my mate who's asking, when was it posted and any name?

Hope all goes smoothly for you & family at this sad time.
Regards
Nigel


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 10:21 am 
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sorry mate i cant recall and have found no details of specs, to busy with other things at this time to search, sorry

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Private When i said there was a camel close by for you to ride i meant you could ride it into town !!!!!!!!!

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.

http://vietnamreenactors.myfastforum.org

http://vietnamuk.moonfruit.com


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