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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 17:11 pm 
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as said its not a simple white/black thing, the grey area is massive.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 18:46 pm 
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Stan Ellis, WW2 veteran and volunteer at Bushy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP3FMLvSczE

I've just done a 24hr box from the pdf I have, but it's different form the photos so far, in that it's rectabgular, as opposed to square which the ones shown appear ot be...

What would be the measurements, and would to conclude, how common where Brit rations?

Anyone got solid evidence, specifications, photographs, or even original examples I could have the measurements?

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ohh look, they got dirty faces ... They say imitation is the best form of flattery ... Done it in 2002 with cries of "hey, did ye no wash yer face this morning"

Strange, they only post in my threads when it's controversial, seems they want to vent their spleens whilst claiming victimhood ; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwVpWFyy3M


"I don't use the pozi net ,because there are too many left wing oversensitive retards on there..."

"I reflect on the infamous 1987 photograph by American artist Andres Serrano that depicts a crucifix submerged in a glass of the artist's urine. I remember all the leftists that jeered and mocked me, and many Christians like me, for being bruised by that photograph (the title of which I would rather not verbalize). They scoffed and told us to get a life. These are the same people today, unsurprisingly, who are stridently arguing for curtailment of free speech not to offend Muslims."


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 18:56 pm 
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In the military museum in Monmouth there is a stunningly beautiful mint tin of WW2 Brit rations.

It is standard baked bean sized can and is painted a dark green, it is stamped by rubber stamp in white and reads something like

"mixed fruit pudding 9/43 made by abc ltd" or something like that


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 18:59 pm 
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Collins wrote:
if they are jungle rations surely they should be in waterproof packaging, it appears that they are packaged in standard brown paper. or am i missing something obvious here


They were, the later jungle ration came in a large, sealed tin with ring-pull opening I think. I believe Martin is also correct in that the rations shown in that photo are from the jungle ration, the style of packing and 'snack' ration tallies with written accounts of how the Jungle ration was packed. Problem is that lot's of items from various periods and types of ration tend to get mixed in together these days, it's difficult to reverse-engineer what was what and how it was packed. I'm leaning towards looking for more primary sources from the mid-war period to really get a handle on what was developed and issued.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 21:49 pm 
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There is this thread going on about boxes....

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=30343

One thing that is common, in both sense's of the word, are stews, bully beef and biscuits. I found, "With the Jocks" to be an interesting read, from a reenactor standpoint about food.

I am a new "serious" student of the British Army. I have dabbled for 20 years. I have only put real research into it in the last year. The last book that I read, "Something about a Soldier", the author mentions getting a small tin of pineapple in the desert. He got it from a roving Naafi truck. Just another little tid bit of information.

The film is interesting. I wonder if they were recieving Canadian rations. The Dodgers seem to get more US and Canadian stuff, than was common to the ETO.

Martin

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 1:02 am 
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TALLERTHANBETTY wrote:
Collins wrote:
if they are jungle rations surely they should be in waterproof packaging, it appears that they are packaged in standard brown paper. or am i missing something obvious here


They were, the later jungle ration came in a large, sealed tin with ring-pull opening I think. I believe Martin is also correct in that the rations shown in that photo are from the jungle ration, the style of packing and 'snack' ration tallies with written accounts of how the Jungle ration was packed. Problem is that lot's of items from various periods and types of ration tend to get mixed in together these days, it's difficult to reverse-engineer what was what and how it was packed. I'm leaning towards looking for more primary sources from the mid-war period to really get a handle on what was developed and issued.


thanks

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:27 am 
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I suspect that Pineapple would have been a supplement to normal rations - The story of how the Pioneers got their nickname of Chunkies is linked...

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Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:36 am 
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So, to conclude...

The British Army had some sort of Composite Ration, which was a days subsistence for 14 men, but there are no records one can check, no one has any examples, and no British Army Quarter Master specifications... That includes the 24hr Ration, which was issued some time in Italy, and some units got issued two of them (24hr) on D-1 Overlord?

The Canadians had them aswell, but as above....

They got Bully beef and biscuits, at some time or other...

The British got issued U.S Army rations most of the time (I'll now direct you to my website, see below), question, would that have been part of "Len Lease"?...

If the above is true, then, really, all British ration issue, whether for private battles or display is really, just fantasy and one can just make up a ration based on researched assumption and the "it looks right" attitude?

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ohh look, they got dirty faces ... They say imitation is the best form of flattery ... Done it in 2002 with cries of "hey, did ye no wash yer face this morning"

Strange, they only post in my threads when it's controversial, seems they want to vent their spleens whilst claiming victimhood ; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwVpWFyy3M


"I don't use the pozi net ,because there are too many left wing oversensitive retards on there..."

"I reflect on the infamous 1987 photograph by American artist Andres Serrano that depicts a crucifix submerged in a glass of the artist's urine. I remember all the leftists that jeered and mocked me, and many Christians like me, for being bruised by that photograph (the title of which I would rather not verbalize). They scoffed and told us to get a life. These are the same people today, unsurprisingly, who are stridently arguing for curtailment of free speech not to offend Muslims."


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:41 am 
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In his book "Memoirs of a soldier," Doug Heathfield-Robinson, who landed on D-Day as a DUKW Driver with the RASC, describes that prior to embarking he was issued with a 24hr Compo Ration pack, containing;

A 3/4lb tin of corned beef.
A packet of 8 cubes of "compact" (tea, powdered milk and sugar).
4 oatmeal biscuits.
A packet of eight biscuits "more like dog biscuits".
A 2oz bar of chocolate.
A few boiled sweets.
A box of matches.

Plus a tin of 50 cigarettes and a solid fuel cooker.

This would seem to bear similarities to the 24hr Ration pack in a cardboard box, though presumably the corned beef was an extra.

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These lists are taken from the same source I quoted in my earlier post, below is in an extract from the document, which was issued by the War Office.

The Composite (14-men) pack was produced for feeding troops on operations, for periods not exceeding 6 weeks and immediately following the consumption of the 24hr ration, which was normally in issue for the first 2 days.

There were two categories of Compo pack - one with biscuit (having seven varieties identified as Types "A" to "G") and one without biscuit for when fresh bread was available, this comprising three varieties designated Types 1, 2 and 3. Solid fuel cookers were not included in either type. The compo pack was not designed for long-term feeding.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:05 am 
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Paul - that gives the impression that, unlike nowadays, there was a unit cental point for feeding?

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Lo, There Do I See My Father
Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

One enemy is never enough, two is far too many
"Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
Jo Hukam


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:19 am 
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Thanks for that Paul, much obliged, any chance you can PM me the book ref. number etc?

I've just read that the British Army serving with the U.S 5th Army in the Italian theatre, between October 1943 and May 1945 received just over a million US rations...

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ohh look, they got dirty faces ... They say imitation is the best form of flattery ... Done it in 2002 with cries of "hey, did ye no wash yer face this morning"

Strange, they only post in my threads when it's controversial, seems they want to vent their spleens whilst claiming victimhood ; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwVpWFyy3M


"I don't use the pozi net ,because there are too many left wing oversensitive retards on there..."

"I reflect on the infamous 1987 photograph by American artist Andres Serrano that depicts a crucifix submerged in a glass of the artist's urine. I remember all the leftists that jeered and mocked me, and many Christians like me, for being bruised by that photograph (the title of which I would rather not verbalize). They scoffed and told us to get a life. These are the same people today, unsurprisingly, who are stridently arguing for curtailment of free speech not to offend Muslims."


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:30 am 
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The ISBN of the book is 0-9534971-9-4, published 2005 by "Bound Biographies" www.boundbiographies.com. I think it was a relatively small print run but you might still be able to get copies. Unfortunately, Doug doesn't quote in the book any official War Office document reference for where the tables came from, although he acknowledges Crown Copyright so there must have been an official source. Sadly, Doug died at the beginning of last year, he was a very active member of our local Normandy Veterans Branch.

In answer to your question Oggy, the idea of the compo pack was that indeed there would be centralised cooking arrangements, presumably using petrol stoves or makeshift fires/ovens. The make-up of a pack doesn't lend itself easily to splitting it up between 14 individual men.

Has anyone considered approaching the Royal Logistic Corps Museum at Camberley? As the succcessor to the Aldershot Concrete Company I'd have thought they may have records, photos or documents detailing the ration packs.

The one thing that has eluded me is trying to locate smooth sided tins of the right size, that are made in gold coloured metal, in order to replicate the tins of the Compo pack. I have found smaller tins which would be ideal if they were bigger, but these days everything seems to be in ribbed tins. Anyone know of any sources?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 9:44 am 
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Redcapsarge wrote:
The ISBN of the book is 0-9534971-9-4, published 2005 by "Bound Biographies" http://www.boundbiographies.com. I think it was a relatively small print run but you might still be able to get copies. Unfortunately, Doug doesn't quote in the book any official War Office document reference for where the tables came from, although he acknowledges Crown Copyright so there must have been an official source. Sadly, Doug died at the beginning of last year, he was a very active member of our local Normandy Veterans Branch.

In answer to your question Oggy, the idea of the compo pack was that indeed there would be centralised cooking arrangements, presumably using petrol stoves or makeshift fires/ovens. The make-up of a pack doesn't lend itself easily to splitting it up between 14 individual men.

Has anyone considered approaching the Royal Logistic Corps Museum at Camberley? As the succcessor to the Aldershot Concrete Company I'd have thought they may have records, photos or documents detailing the ration packs.

The one thing that has eluded me is trying to locate smooth sided tins of the right size, that are made in gold coloured metal, in order to replicate the tins of the Compo pack. I have found smaller tins which would be ideal if they were bigger, but these days everything seems to be in ribbed tins. Anyone know of any sources?


Again, thanks for yer info...

As regards tins, aldis/lidls (always get them both mixed up for some reason) they sell evaporated milk and used to do clementines in smooth sided, now ring pull and ribbed (they where ideal for C ration tins- I remember buying all the crates on the shelf of them, the next customer "I can ye see ye like clementines", little did he know), ye can get small tins from other stores, things like tomato puree and sardines which I know are close to US army rations, but know of little other nations rations...

Hope this helps...

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ohh look, they got dirty faces ... They say imitation is the best form of flattery ... Done it in 2002 with cries of "hey, did ye no wash yer face this morning"

Strange, they only post in my threads when it's controversial, seems they want to vent their spleens whilst claiming victimhood ; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwVpWFyy3M


"I don't use the pozi net ,because there are too many left wing oversensitive retards on there..."

"I reflect on the infamous 1987 photograph by American artist Andres Serrano that depicts a crucifix submerged in a glass of the artist's urine. I remember all the leftists that jeered and mocked me, and many Christians like me, for being bruised by that photograph (the title of which I would rather not verbalize). They scoffed and told us to get a life. These are the same people today, unsurprisingly, who are stridently arguing for curtailment of free speech not to offend Muslims."


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 15:54 pm 
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Cheers Paul

_________________
Lo, There Do I See My Father
Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

One enemy is never enough, two is far too many
"Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
Jo Hukam


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2011 17:54 pm 
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Just an update on the ones ive made. Ive now waxed the boxes and to be honest with you it was a bit of a pain in the arse. trying to get an even coat without the wax drying off too early took some doing, turns out the best one i did was the first one, they got progressivly worse from then on in

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