WWIIReenacting.co.uk Forums

Uniting UK Re-enactors since 2003
 

It is currently Wed Jul 18, 2018 14:45 pm

Support the Forum
END OF YEAR OFFER - HALF PRICE SUPPORTER MEMBERSHIPS - CLICK THE BANNER TO READ MORE AND SUPPORT THE FORUM

Username



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 259 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17  Next
Author Message
Offline
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2010 10:51 am 
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:44 am
Posts: 118
Location: Sunny crewkerne
Real Name: lee
Group: Devonshires
rockhopper your almost certainly right to be fair it was many years ago. what you remember isnt always what you think you saw :-)


Top
 

Support the Forum
END OF YEAR OFFER - HALF PRICE SUPPORTER MEMBERSHIPS - CLICK THE BANNER TO READ MORE AND SUPPORT THE FORUM

Username
Offline
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2010 16:08 pm 
3000+ Poster
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 16:44 pm
Posts: 3539
Group: AFRA
If you ever see it done to a shopping bag full of offal, it'll get the message home. Very messy :)

_________________
Image

http://www.afra.org.uk


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2010 17:04 pm 
Forum Legend
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 13:36 pm
Posts: 25060
Location: Hartlepool, awaiting a Zulu charge, cuppa in hand
Real Name: Ian Hannant
Group: Unable to commit
Oh yes...

_________________
Lo, There Do I See My Father
Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

One enemy is never enough, two is far too many
"Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
Jo Hukam


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2010 19:13 pm 
3000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 10:35 am
Posts: 3983
Real Name: boris bagbogbigban
i've spent years muzzle loading. When you see what wadding you've put in to get the compression for a "bang", you know its got to come out again.

That said grass or toilet paper strips as wadding breaks up quite quickly.

But its a fact that a blank has wadding and it won't be grass of paper?

I've also been hit by metal fragments in the face in the past couple of years from either enfields or kar98s. that hurts!

Been hit by grass wads loads of times... It doesn't.

Of course sometime load 'cow processed grass' that gives good compression and stays together in flight to give appearance of solid shot, or is that solid shi*?

_________________
Like a tree in a deserted forest.


If you have the last word and no one heard it - Did it happen? https://youtu.be/mQZmCJUSC6g


(No)


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:38 pm 
3000+ Poster
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 16:44 pm
Posts: 3539
Group: AFRA
I do recall, many years ago at Standrop camp, an individual (no names, no pack drill) pushing sheep s**t into the muzzle of a K98 and firing it towards the "enemy". No idea if it actually went the distance without being vaporised :)

_________________
Image

http://www.afra.org.uk


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:44 pm 
3000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 10:35 am
Posts: 3983
Real Name: boris bagbogbigban
BaggyPants wrote:
I do recall, many years ago at Standrop camp, an individual (no names, no pack drill) pushing sheep s**t into the muzzle of a K98 and firing it towards the "enemy". No idea if it actually went the distance without being vaporised :)

Depends how old sheep or rabbit poo..... was it crusty?
I can write a book on the various excrement loads.

One thing about loading with sh*t is no one stands in front of you!

But there's a difference between a +2" bore muzzle loading cannon and a kar98.......i can see a legal issue.

Silliest thing i've seen first hand was someone shot by a malteazer. He'd insisted the chocolate would melt and the honeycombe break up in flight..... It didn't.

It stung.

_________________
Like a tree in a deserted forest.


If you have the last word and no one heard it - Did it happen? https://youtu.be/mQZmCJUSC6g


(No)


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 4:58 am 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2009 16:13 pm
Posts: 88
Location: Church tower, Saint-Aubin-Sur-Mer
When I first applied for my FAC the visiting officer told me when he joined up in the 80's his first job was to investigate a guy that was shot in the calf during a re-enactment. Luckily it was only the bullet from a drill round he had been using at a previous event (I say luckily as I think they are hollow??), the guy didnt know it was there, he loaded a blank. BANG, out came the bullet straight into his mates leg!


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:02 am 
5000+ Poster
 Profile

Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 19:19 pm
Posts: 9785
Location: Near Guildford,Surrey
Real Name: Andy Wood
Group: 16PFA / AFRA
Fresh Air Sniper wrote:
When I first applied for my FAC the visiting officer told me when he joined up in the 80's his first job was to investigate a guy that was shot in the calf during a re-enactment. Luckily it was only the bullet from a drill round he had been using at a previous event (I say luckily as I think they are hollow??), the guy didnt know it was there, he loaded a blank. BANG, out came the bullet straight into his mates leg!

Good example of weapon discipline (or rather the lack of it), NEVER assume a weapon is empty...make sure first! :wink:


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 13:49 pm 
Forum Legend
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 13:36 pm
Posts: 25060
Location: Hartlepool, awaiting a Zulu charge, cuppa in hand
Real Name: Ian Hannant
Group: Unable to commit
britishwardog wrote:
Fresh Air Sniper wrote:
When I first applied for my FAC the visiting officer told me when he joined up in the 80's his first job was to investigate a guy that was shot in the calf during a re-enactment. Luckily it was only the bullet from a drill round he had been using at a previous event (I say luckily as I think they are hollow??), the guy didnt know it was there, he loaded a blank. BANG, out came the bullet straight into his mates leg!

Good example of weapon discipline (or rather the lack of it), NEVER assume a weapon is empty...make sure first! :wink:

True - the most pathetic phrase you will ever hear - 'I didn't know it was loaded'...

_________________
Lo, There Do I See My Father
Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

One enemy is never enough, two is far too many
"Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
Jo Hukam


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 21:17 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 18:24 pm
Posts: 171
Real Name: Mark Stubbings
Group: The Great Exhibitonists
Question as to why blanks have to be so loud?

well they don't

there are plenty of propellent powders that have less bang for the same force, enough to cyycle the action certainly for less volume, problem is either 'costs' OR ' people want louder bangs '

why does anyone want red tip blanks?

the standard Fiocchi 8mm is way louder than the military used 9mm blank, which incidently happily cycles a sterling L2 A3 , and by inference a real sten

just need to see the plugfire cap guns, front venting , but usually available on a couple of kinds, either louder, or quieter with more sparks

at Chatham dockyards 'salute to the 40's ' , the whole area could hear the 8mm standard ( NOT RED TIP ) blanks fired occasionally through the day ,to give the effect of AA guns ( funniest part was when a small single engined aircraft flew over to the instant result of Air Raid sirens and a burst of 10-12 rounds , my other half said ' Oh God, they're not shooting that down are they?' bless .)

When they fired the 8mm with the vent across the water, the echoes came back quite clearly , so yes blanks can be too loud, 8m seem to me to be louder than a standard 12 bore cartridge

with regards to how to use top venting, point the damn thing to the side or 6 foot over the head of the target re-enactor, and let the blast go upwards , if they're closer than about 30 feet than point off to the side, either way , make sure the top venting is going vertical

one of our colleagues is/was selling a Bruni 8mm Colt for spares, simply because the vent hole was disintegrating, good for him for saying SPARES, because as sure as hells for sinners, some poor sod would get the remainder of the vent section surgically removed at a later date if some twit bought it and decided to fire in 'gangsta' style

Blanks and Pyro are NEVER safe, one of the safest events i've ever been to had a thumbnail sized piece of shrapnel ( okay part of a cooking oil drum ) land beside me, only 20 yards from the 2oz of pyro used for the bang, admittedly there was no way it could have got to me directly , it had to travel some, it landed about 2 seconds AFTER the bang, having spent some time in 'housten we have a problem' territory , but if it had been a less professional team doing pyro's it might have been the entirety of the oil drum :shock:

so never ever attend an event that doesn't have professional 'bang teams'

and never ever ever ever assume that a blank is safe, even the PFCaps can and will disconcert and alarm Joe Public if they get ND'd right next to them, and they're less loud than a party popper

plastic carrier bag of offal, 303 blank, point blank, result , ( and i think this was done just to get the floor re polished ) blood and guts all over nicel polished floor

second varient 7.62 , empty compo food tin placed on muzzle ,
huge dome shaped comp tin and a huge dent in tree

third varient 9mm std blank, boiled egg ( suggested as Eye equivalent ) now totally scrambled and spread around so much you wouldn't want it on your toast

this was no surprise to me , because as a cadet i saw a 303 blank totally rip through a stale loaf of bread leaving just a shell

12 BORE

these are mainly used as poachers alarms etc, but its STILL not good to be near them , and not only because the gamekeeper will come running

a 12 bore blank set on one of the 'land mine ' traps WILL turn a leg of pork into something you wouldn't want to consider eating

this is one you CAN do at home or at least in the garden , a poachers trap, a long line of string, and try placing an old boot weighted down with offal right on top of the blank mine.

warn your neighbours

add ear protection

pull the string

and now you will never ever be careless about blanks again :)

_________________
Never underestimate the power of Human Stupidity..........Especially mine.
Cosplay.....................Destroying our heritage since 1977
C96, Mg34, Mg42, Sterling, Lewis gun, LeMat, M19 Sight, feel free to add more..


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 1:59 am 
3000+ Poster
 WWW  Profile

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 16:44 pm
Posts: 3539
Group: AFRA
Daze wrote:
Blanks and Pyro are NEVER safe, one of the safest events i've ever been to had a thumbnail sized piece of shrapnel ( okay part of a cooking oil drum ) land beside me, only 20 yards from the 2oz of pyro used for the bang, admittedly there was no way it could have got to me directly , it had to travel some, it landed about 2 seconds AFTER the bang, having spent some time in 'housten we have a problem' territory , but if it had been a less professional team doing pyro's it might have been the entirety of the oil drum :shock:

so never ever attend an event that doesn't have professional 'bang teams'


I'd be interested in your definition of a professional pyro team. As with most things, being paid to do something doesn't necessarily make the "professionals" better or safer than so called "amateurs". And whoever put pyro in an old cooking oil drum wants slapping to death with the ends of their own ripped of arms! Also, how did you know it was a 2oz charge and what composition was it? I'm presuming it was homemade and probably black powder, because all the manufacturers we deal with work in grammes. If that is the case, how on earth can it have been one of the safest events you've ever been to? You must have been to every stinker going. Come and see what we do. The safety will blow you away :D

_________________
Image

http://www.afra.org.uk


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 17:54 pm 
4000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 20:25 pm
Posts: 4739
Location: The auld empty barn
BaggyPants wrote:
I do recall, many years ago at Standrop camp, an individual (no names, no pack drill) pushing sheep s**t into the muzzle of a K98 and firing it towards the "enemy". No idea if it actually went the distance without being vaporised :)


Yes,but those were mad times (allegedly) and there always was a LOT of sheep sh!t around(and dead sheep if I recall). I think the improvised rifle grenades/airbombs being fired (allegedly)straight into "enemy" occupied buildings was probably more dangerous....and a whole lot more fun :twisted: (allegedly)'mind you,I was 16/17 at the time,its all fun at that age :)
But I do clearly remember a lad getting his hand mangled by a sten gun though,and my putting a 60 year old first feild dressing on the wound.....opposite the camp cinema.

Remember at Twinnwoods getting almost hypnotised by the mess my K98 was making of the leaves and twigs in a tree about 10/15 foot away from me...
And also the disconcerting feel of the presure of a nagant being fired straight up between my legs from behind as I was in a prone firing position at detling once:shock: Thanks comrade....

_________________
Re enactors of all countries,unite!

War,huh,what is it good for? Absolutly nothin'.......but some jolly good films

. -. --. .-.. .- -. -.. / . -..- .--. . -.-. - ... / . ...- . .-. -.-- -- .- -. / - --- / -.. --- / .... .. ... / -.. ..- - -.--


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 19:37 pm 
 Profile

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2011 19:16 pm
Posts: 157
Real Name: Jack
Group: SBG
Stupid question I know but it's just something I want to know before I do something silly and blow someone's face across the field.
Say there's a yank/buck toothed tommy/hairy a**ed Ivan on the field about two to five metres away, should I shout Bang bang? or should I pop him with a pistol ?
Also whats the minimum engagement distance with blank firers?

_________________
lordduvet wrote:
just remember no matter how wrong it is for your grandad to be dressed up as major richard winters, its far far more wrong for your granny to be dressed as betty grable or marilyn monroe


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 20:14 pm 
1000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:51 am
Posts: 1079
Location: London, UK
Real Name: Roger
Group: Cold War Provost (section of Forces 80)
When I was Range Safety Officer qualified in the T.A. (the qualification at the time was "SA(B)90" for those in the know), the rule in the Army was do NOT engage closer than 10 metres (30 feet), and ALWAYS aim off (aim to the target's left or right, so as to avoid directly targetting the individual).

Main reason: Military blank firing is performed with real firearms capped with Blank Firing Attachments which allow blanks to provide the rifles and machine guns the energy to work their gas-fed mechanisms; the BFAs in effect 'neck down' the muzzle of the weapons involved, to allow this to happen, while allowing a small amount of gas (smoke) and fire (muzzle flash) to escape; therefore, there is always a danger of particulate matter - wadding or whatnot - being fired out along the line of the barrel, and hitting a close-by target.

Secondary reason: Prevention of Hearing damage. Again, the majority of the sound from firing will be directed forwards of the weapon; while there will not, of course, be the supersonic crack of a round being fired, the detonation sound from a blank at close range is still hazardous to the targets' hearing, hence the minimum engagement range in order to minimise, where possible, the potential for such damage.

One other thing comes immediately to my mind, though. I may have missed the background of the question, but judging by what you asked, it occurred that you might be saying that there wil be ad-hoc engagements in your event; If so, "STOP STOP STOP". Do NOT allow such a risky and potentially dangerous thing to happen.

Battle re-enactments should be fully planned, with attention to detail from experienced event organisers, Range Safety Marshals, and Pyrotechnics experts agreeing what will happen, where, when, and why. Ad-hoc engagemnts are ingherently dangerous, and shold be avoided at ALL costs, not least due to the risk of an engagement occurring in too close a proximity to the public.

Your 3PLI is, obviously, at risk, if you do NOT properly prepare an engagement plan and adequately assess ALL the potential risks involved.

Anyhow, I hope the above helps.

_________________
Cheers for now,

Roger

Cold War Provost LHG
Image
*Winners: Military Mayhem 2009 Best Living History Display :mrgreen:
Confirmed member of the Bunker Bash Drinking Team
Image

HALT!
Bang Bang Bang Bang Bang!
Britische Militärpolizei!
Bang Bang Bang Bang Bang!
Halt oder ich schießen!
Klicken
Oops!


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 20:32 pm 
 Profile

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2011 19:16 pm
Posts: 157
Real Name: Jack
Group: SBG
It does, thanks
What I meant to ask, or one of the things I meant to ask was 'what do I do with someone inside that range'?
Also is a blank firing pistol less dangerous at close range than a rifle, or should both be treated equally?

_________________
lordduvet wrote:
just remember no matter how wrong it is for your grandad to be dressed up as major richard winters, its far far more wrong for your granny to be dressed as betty grable or marilyn monroe


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 20:44 pm 
1000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:51 am
Posts: 1079
Location: London, UK
Real Name: Roger
Group: Cold War Provost (section of Forces 80)
heh, before they started giveing the TA the chance to use that laser engagement training system, there was a LOT of "BANG! You're dead!" and "**** OFF!" replies *evil grin*

Seriously, I'd treat them both the same, and I woldn't engage at closer than 30 feet - it's just not safe, IMHO. I'd yell "BANG!" and be ready for a torrent of nasty words in reply ;-)

As to danger, think about it. They're as dangerous as each other.

_________________
Cheers for now,

Roger

Cold War Provost LHG
Image
*Winners: Military Mayhem 2009 Best Living History Display :mrgreen:
Confirmed member of the Bunker Bash Drinking Team
Image

HALT!
Bang Bang Bang Bang Bang!
Britische Militärpolizei!
Bang Bang Bang Bang Bang!
Halt oder ich schießen!
Klicken
Oops!


Top
 

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 259 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to: