WWIIReenacting.co.uk Forums

Uniting UK Re-enactors since 2003
 

It is currently Tue Dec 10, 2019 3:41 am

Support the Forum
END OF YEAR OFFER - HALF PRICE SUPPORTER MEMBERSHIPS - CLICK THE BANNER TO READ MORE AND SUPPORT THE FORUM

Username



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 
Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Spiv/civilian outfit.
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 10:27 am 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Hi everyone.
My son and I are putting together a 'spiv'/civilian outfit for him. I think he has everything, but he still needs a gas mask box/bag. Would he have had a cardboard boxed one with a string? Or a bag? Also as regards shoes. He has some tan brogues which we can easily darken, but would the soles have been thinner than many inexpensive modern ones, and would the toes have been more rounded than pointed? The ones he has are, I guess, sort of in-between. Sorry for my ignorance, but just want to make sure.
Many thanks in advance.

Richard.


Top
 

Support the Forum
END OF YEAR OFFER - HALF PRICE SUPPORTER MEMBERSHIPS - CLICK THE BANNER TO READ MORE AND SUPPORT THE FORUM

Username
Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 21:03 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 20:16 pm
Posts: 545
Location: south east uk
Group: 'To Victory, Together!' (Me, him and the dog)
Hi Richard.
Assuming your son is an adult, he should be aiming to portray an average civilian rather than try to emulate the spivs that are seen at events which is pretty much an image taken from post war comedians. A true black marketeer during the war would be dressed the same as any civilian, as the last thing he would want to do is to stand out and therefore attract attention to his activities.If he is not part of the civilian services such as ARP he would have just a civilian gas mask box rather than a service respirator in a bag.
Tan coloured shoes are fine with a round toe but try to find one's that have a smooth welted sole.
Jude


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 21:12 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 14:02 pm
Posts: 657
Location: Derby
Real Name: Matt Moore
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry, F.I.R.E.44
I can vouch that he did look very good when I saw him at Papplewick. The civilian impression is not one done by many his age with many going for the cherry beret instead and I think he pulled it off very well indeed.

I'm sure with your advice on board Jude, his impression will continue to get even better. (Until I poach/persuade him to don the Denison! :lol: )

All the best,
Matt

_________________
https://www.facebook.com/poorbloodyinfantry


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 21:37 pm 
1000+ Poster
 Profile

Joined: Fri Aug 01, 2008 11:35 am
Posts: 1112
Real Name: Martin Sole
utilityjude wrote:
Tan coloured shoes are fine with a round toe but try to find one's that have a smooth welted sole.


:?:

Jude can you explain what a smooth welted sole is? Or better yet, show a picture?

_________________
I may not know much about history but I know what I like


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:48 am 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 20:16 pm
Posts: 545
Location: south east uk
Group: 'To Victory, Together!' (Me, him and the dog)
No! Don't poach.
Pleaaaaaase.
So many just want to wear uniforms.
It's brilliant to see a young man (still assuming young, as quite a lot of older ones just want to don a cherry beret too) in good civilian attire.


Not very good with technical stuff, including shoes, but I mean smooth soles, leather ones, rather than the ones with treads and by welt I mean the way they are chunkier at the sides with the stitching exposed from above. Takes me ages to attempt pictures on this thing but googling welted sole brings up lots of images.

Am I correct here? Don't want to give false info!
Jude


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:05 am 
1000+ Poster
 Profile

Joined: Fri Aug 01, 2008 11:35 am
Posts: 1112
Real Name: Martin Sole
Ah, OK. Just regular classic style, stitched leather soled shoes then.
Was there any austerity measure for repairing holes in shoes?
I know that in WWI Germany the shortage of leather meant that bootmakers used compressed waxed cardboard for certain parts. And that was for military footwear, so heaven knows what the civvies did for shoes!

_________________
I may not know much about history but I know what I like


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:12 am 
3000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 10:35 am
Posts: 3983
Real Name: boris bagbogbigban
BedsnHerts wrote:
Ah, OK. Just regular classic style, stitched leather soled shoes then.
Was there any austerity measure for repairing holes in shoes?
I know that in WWI Germany the shortage of leather meant that bootmakers used compressed waxed cardboard for certain parts. And that was for military footwear, so heaven knows what the civvies did for shoes!



wood wasn't it

Maurice chevalier sang about it .

_________________
Like a tree in a deserted forest.


If you have the last word and no one heard it - Did it happen? https://youtu.be/mQZmCJUSC6g


(No)


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:13 am 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 20:16 pm
Posts: 545
Location: south east uk
Group: 'To Victory, Together!' (Me, him and the dog)
Have had public tell me that as kids, their dad's used to mend them with all sorts of things of bits and bobs, rubbish to us. Including bits of perished bicycle tyres.
Jude


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 16:22 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Thanks everyone for the input. My son is only just 14 but he is already just a tad under 6'0, so I think he can get away with it. As Matt said he really does like portraying civilian rather than military. (I blame James Beck myself!!). I have been trying to get him to come along for ages and was chuffed with the response he got. His shoes have got a flat thin sole with a good brogue styling, and he wore his white school shirt which does have, from what I can gather, a pretty accurate style of collar for the period. He is continually trying to improve his image, as we all are so I will try and post some pictures I have of him, and any critique will be most welcome.

Thanks

Richard.


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 16:47 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Piccies of Ollie as promised. Critique welcome.
Cheers
Richard.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 16:52 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Trying a bigger pic.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 18:15 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 20:16 pm
Posts: 545
Location: south east uk
Group: 'To Victory, Together!' (Me, him and the dog)
14 and 6 foot tall.....what have you been feeding him on. :D
Well done that lad.
Funnily enough, during the war, he would have had extra clothing coupons from other young teens as he would be over height for his age, although at 14 he may just been in long shorts rather than full blown suits.(but he would be a brave lad today if he did)
Although hard to see,(and my eyesight is deserting me) I think the brogues look more like continental shoes, without the welted sole rather than good old British shoes. Have a google of Oxford Brogues to get a better idea.
Although a pair of patent utility shoes for men on ebay lately,looked very unlike the Classic Brogues we tend to think off, just to show that you can always be prooved wrong, whatever you think.
I would encourage him to loose the suitcase though and just stick with a gas mask over the shoulder.
He'll get better and better, little by little, like we all do with lots of encouragement.

Jude


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 19:43 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Many thanks Jude, very kind words. I will pass them on to him! It's hard to think he is that tall considering him mum is five foot and a bit and he's a good couple of inches taller than me :shock: :shock: I think the suit case is more of a prop for him at the mo, but I guess in a few years time we could re-introduce it. The shoes were just a cheap option off e-bay, as didn't want to splash out too much as his shoe size changes almost every month!! However if he keeps at it, enjoys it and his feet stop growing I am sure we can obtain some better quality shoes. I am still looking for a good quality gas mask box for him. I was given a link to some but after trying to contact the people I have had no response, so still on the hunt.
Keep the ideas coming please folks, the more the merrier!!

Thanks again,
Richard.


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 19:54 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 20:16 pm
Posts: 545
Location: south east uk
Group: 'To Victory, Together!' (Me, him and the dog)
Hi Richard.
Send him into the local charity shops now it's half term. You can often get lovely bespoke men's shoes for peanuts.....£2.50 etc. Have always picked up ones for my hubby from here as well vintage boots. There are some good repro cardboard boxes on the net, you could re-inforce them with more card from cereal boxes and use them for sarnies at events.
Jude


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 19:57 pm 
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 13:17 pm
Posts: 162
Real Name: Richard Cammack
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
Great Idea about the shoes, now I know exactly what to look for!!


Top
 

Offline
PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:47 am 
1000+ Poster
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 19:41 pm
Posts: 1795
Location: North Staffordshire.
Real Name: Martin Clewlow
Ollie looks spot-on, and thankfully not like a Spiv.

It's a pity more folk don't realise that the name Spiv really wasn't a compliment...

_________________
"I say, there's a fellow on this train wearing brown shoes."
ImageImage


Top
 

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron