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 Post subject: Blacksea Fleet
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2004 22:49 pm 
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Looking for web based info on ww2 red navy uniforms,any ideas as I keep coming up blank on searches :(
chears
.kostya.


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PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 8:06 am 
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I've never found much on the internet, but good luck with finding the kit because it gets quite pricey for Soviet gear.

Anyway, the troops we call Naval Infantry are actually made up of two types...

Morskaya Pekhota - Naval Infantry. These guys are Marines but in WW2 they aren't a separate corps they just provided troops like a Captain's guard on ship and manned shore batteries in Naval installations. They wore army uniforms & rank badges with Naval distinctions - navy buttons, a foul anchor sleeve badge, the naval belt, the striped shirt and the 'Donald Duck' hat. They were formed into brigades and stayed under Navy command throughout the war. They were expanded post war and became a separate corps in 1960.

Morskaya Strelkovaya - Naval Rifles. These are the guys taken off ships and given rifles. They continued to wear navy uniform but over time army uniform replaced it the only things they kept were the striped shirt, the hat and the belt. These brigades were usually transferred to army control.

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PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 11:01 am 
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I've looked and looked and looked for Naval Infantry stuff on the web - plenty of postwar stuff when they reinvented them in the 60's but not much before on what the fascists called "der schwarze Tod" - the black death (because of their ferrociousness and black uniforms...). In Romania and Norway the locals thought they were vampires because they came out at night, caused carnage and wore black capes :)

Couple of tips for you on Naval things Comrade:

1) Watch out for "modern" donald ducks (Naval hats) - after the 50's the crown is MUCH bigger.

2) Tallys (the name on the hat and the "tails") also are different postwar. Particularly watch out for the adition of the words "red banner" to the fleet name as these battle honours were not awarded until postwar for wartime actions.

3) Belt buckles - easy to find a "modern" naval belt and buckle and they are largely the same, however the edges of a wartime buckle are more rounded than postwar.

4) Naval buttons should be brass not staybrite - obvious point I know. Brass naval buttons are a bastid to find. You could paint the staybrite ones...

5) The striped naval shirts (telnyaska) are still the same - FSU or Rus Military sell them. Don't get the sleavless vests tho - those are modern! Also, the naval ones are dark blue and white, VDV ones are light blue - make sure you ask for the right thing :)

6) Toecapless RN deck boots are good for Naval stuff... assuming you want to be Navy Infantry and not Naval Infantry - see Sasha's description above.

I have some Naval kit for sale if you are interested...

The Navy stuff has always interested me :)

I've also got some books you might like to read at some point - "With the Red Fleet", "Blood on the Shores" and "Commandos from the Sea" - the latter two are about Naval Scouts - double hard bastids!!!

Oh and talk to your C/O about the fouled anchor patches for your gym if you want to do the green wearing Naval Infantry as I know he repros them.

Lastly, I've got some nice heroic tales from the seige of Sevastopol to inspire you in your defence of the Motherland - pm me and I'll send them to you :)

Andrei Ivanovich

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PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 21:46 pm 
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Cheers Frontovik ,Kozlov, :)
Im glad its not just me then that cant find it on the web :) :? wonder why that is? I mean theyre such an iconic symbol of all things soviet.
I found a supply of "donald duck"(ugh so capitalist :wink: ) caps some wartime and some post war ,the wartime ones were ,surprise surprise,tiny but the post war one(leningrad1961) i got had the same size crown as the wartime ones,some of the later 60s ones were HUGE though,almost comic opera :shock: .the tally is for chernomopskoi flot(Yorkshire phonetics :oops: ) were the wartime ones printed?
And yeah I'll be getting intouch with starshinii when more info about the event comes through but I still need some of the basics for streltsi yet but the navy stuff is defianatly a future project.

.kostya.


Last edited by kostya on Sat May 15, 2004 10:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat May 15, 2004 9:39 am 
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Ooohhh last tip - the capstar for a donald duck is "medium size" - ie bigger than the pilotka star and smaller than the ushanka star :)

My postwar d/d has a ushanka sized star on it - looks original too, have got the medium sized one to swap at some point....

And yes, for some reason they only come in bloody small sizes!

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PostPosted: Sat May 15, 2004 10:24 am 
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Looks like I made a lucky buy(rare :oops: )the badge is what looks to be medium sized but oddly enough is smaller than the badge on my pre war pilotka, and the caps a size 59 :!: :!: ,now Ive removed the metal band from the crown its tacking on a real "sevastapol"look :) .

.kostya.


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PostPosted: Sat May 15, 2004 17:31 pm 
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59!

Good grief! Thats almost human size!

I think mine is a 58, which just about balances on the back of my head... as long as I havent got to do anything too energetic, I'll be fine :)

You'll have to let me know where you found yours!

Oh the peacoats can be found too - well, modern ones, swap the buttons and leave the bottom one off and its not too bad - tip from a friend of mine from Leningrad. Mind you, someone else who i know who's dead into Red Fleet stuff said his original WW2 peacoat was a totally different cut. I havent compared them myself to be able to say which statement is true!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2004 14:18 pm 
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Igor is selling ( Collectrussia.com) modern Pea Coats at $69 dollars if your interested......

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2004 14:57 pm 
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They are quite different actually!

Since that last message I have a 80's Red Fleet uniform and the peajacket is quite different to Steve's wartime one...

However it is a lovely piece of kit and dead warm :)

http://www.russianisland.com have lots of lovely naval stuff :)

Andy

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2004 15:40 pm 
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Just a note, I've found from certain books that there were Naval Pioneers as they had their own style buckles on the belts, a pre war thing apparently, espenlaub had some, I don't know if they've still got it, I've still got some Pioneer/Komsomol stuff to get for my little report on it all :twisted:

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