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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 13:36 pm 
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Location: Athens-Greece
Real Name: George
Group: WW2 GREEK ARMY 1940-41 REENACTING TEAM
Yin717 wrote:
Problem with these types of forces. They copy stuff from other countries, or use their equipment and so there is so much equipment that is passable ect. Gosh its confusing! lol.

I could say that in our case that makes things a lot easier because imagine what would happen if we had to find only greek production material when nobody makes here replicas.

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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 15:25 pm 
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Location: Luton and Stoke-on-Trent
Real Name: Ieuan Smith (Joe)
Group: Poor Bloody Infantry
This is also true. lol. But it just confuses the hell out of me when they used a broad range of equipment. I mean I read that during the war the Greek's had like 4 'main' uniforms at once?


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 23:16 pm 
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Yin717 wrote:
This is also true. lol. But it just confuses the hell out of me when they used a broad range of equipment. I mean I read that during the war the Greek's had like 4 'main' uniforms at once?


That's a bit of an exaggeration, we are talking about minor differences in this period service dress, like shape of buttons and cuffs/no cuffs, straight/pointy pockets. The basic shape did not change much from 1908. And photos show the vast majority was quite consistent to the latest pattern. E.g. I have not spotted front-line photos of OR in British service dress for example, though there is abundant speculation that this did happen in very small numbers, and probably in third line support units or in the Macedonian forts. Minor variety seen in Greek patterns generally reflects old stocks used for new mobilised troops, depletion of materials or -less likely- contractors using different patterns. Admitedly there was more variability in the leatherwear, weapons and gear rather clothing as such.

To cut a long story short, as always in reenactment, if it is supported from high level evidence, ie photos or actual artifacts, is oK!

Going away for a bit, when I find the time (and a bloody camera that works) I will try to show you pieces from my collection. Even better, when we meet this season.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:40 am 
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Be really interesting. :)

I personally was going to stick with the 1908 (as you call it) as thats the most documented in photos and such. That and it does make them more 'unique'. lol.

But be great to see you equipment. Just hope we could meet up soon during this season and really discuss the finer details. lol. Greek is something I'd really like to go into as its very much forgotten. Some people can't believe some of the stuff those Greek soldiers did! Would be considered insane today. lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 13:35 pm 
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Real Name: George
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Things done so far
Replica M33 helmet (fiberglass polyester)

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Mind that pouches are not correctly attached...
Image
Image

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"Only the dead have seen the end of war"
Plato
Greek author & philosopher in Athens (427 BC - 347 BC)

https://www.facebook.com/WW2-Greek-Army ... 751753340/


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 13:48 pm 
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I was informed that on the SD they didnt have those tabs things under the collar? And photos seemed to suggest that? As I was looking into get some British SD that had that and was informed about that issue. Prepared to be corrected. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 14:10 pm 
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Erm, are those hooks not supposed to fit on the loops on top of the ammo pouches? It looks damn uncomfortable and unreliable like that.

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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 14:57 pm 
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Yin717 wrote:
I was informed that on the SD they didnt have those tabs things under the collar? And photos seemed to suggest that? As I was looking into get some British SD that had that and was informed about that issue. Prepared to be corrected. :)

Image

This is from 1935


You are right Oggy , i already mentioned that they aren't correctly attached.

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"Only the dead have seen the end of war"
Plato
Greek author & philosopher in Athens (427 BC - 347 BC)

https://www.facebook.com/WW2-Greek-Army ... 751753340/


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 16:16 pm 
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:oops: Gio - couldn't see that, sorry :oops:
Yin - those are Rifle Patches, a feature of 02 and 22 Pattern SD - there was, however an Austerity Pattern of SD which didn't have them - perhaps that type found it's way into the Greek system?

_________________
Lo, There Do I See My Father
Lo, There Do I See My Mother, My Sisters And My Brothers
Lo, There Do I See My People, Back To The Beginning
Lo, There Do They Call To Me, And Beg Me To Take My Place
In The Halls Of Valhalla, Where the Brave Shall Live Forever

In the chaos of battle, when the ground beneath your feet is a slurry of blood, puke, p**s and the entrails of friends and enemies alike, it's easy to turn to the gods for salvation. But it's soldiers who do the fighting, and soldiers who do the dying, and the gods never get their feet wet.

One enemy is never enough, two is far too many
"Bravery is being the only one who knows you're afraid."
Jo Hukam


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 21:44 pm 
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Oggy wrote:
:oops: Gio - couldn't see that, sorry :oops:
Yin - those are Rifle Patches, a feature of 02 and 22 Pattern SD - there was, however an Austerity Pattern of SD which didn't have them - perhaps that type found it's way into the Greek system?


Cool looking! And honestly I am flabbergasted with the convincing results of the
synthetic helmet, OMG!

Once and for all, what you see above in Giorgos posts is a British SD, 1922 model.
What we say is that few of these passed in early 1941 as aid to third-rate troops,
and most even came with GS buttons, we did not have time and resources.
Admittedly they are many more British SD seen in Asia Minor campaign photos and early Republic
like the above (which my guess is more around 1925 rather so late as Giorgos says)
and typical of a massive Army using anything to hand to dress waves and waves
of new recruits after 4 consecutive wars and The Catastrophe.

Things in terms of resources and investment improved a lot in the thirties, so
you see much less motley appearance after 1935.

Also what you see in the war-time pictures are various versions of GREEK SD the so-called
model of 1908, is not economy or 'utility' British without rifle Patches or whatever.

When I fix my camera I will post you a picture of it to see how different it is.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 23:08 pm 
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So.....I've been left more confused.....lol.

I respect the photo. It seems that the British SD tunic with that patch was used, however the Greeks made their own without it?

Hope I got it?

lol. Like I said, really confused.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:08 am 
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Yin717 wrote:
So.....I've been left more confused.....lol.

I respect the photo. It seems that the British SD tunic with that patch was used, however the Greeks made their own without it?

Hope I got it?

lol. Like I said, really confused.



Correct. Plus many other little different details that to the trained eye makes
an obviously different uniform! Fabric, buttons, pockets, cuffs, stitching, vents, lining,
are all different!
I conclude that we only used exceptionally British SD tunics in periods of
economic hardship and foreign aid from the UK Alllies,
i.e. Asia Minor-early 20s, then again in the later stages of 40-41 war,
but I reiterate, in very, very small numbers. Still have not seen
any photo from latter period to confirm this, and I have reviewed 100s.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 15:42 pm 
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Interesting. I guess sourcing these uniforms is gonna be alot harder than I imagined lol.

But your comments on the photo's was very helpful as I had seen colour photos of Greeks in what appeared to be Khaki uniforms. Evidently, as you have described, an issue of light ect.

Any complications on the trousers? Also, I take it the best thing to do is try to source some sort of Greek uniform? Trying to convert a British SD tunic will be very complicated if at all possible?


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 23:38 pm 
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Real Name: George
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The real thing...
Mind that the collar tabs are wrong (soldiers don't have flames , black tab is for artillery)

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

I also saw a British SD tunic that was given to the Greek Army and was totally khaki brown, it still has the British buttons not in gold but in green color.

Yin717 you better try to convert a british SD and trousers also , you will never find anything similar to greek sd of this era ,the real ones are very rare and expensive...

_________________
"Only the dead have seen the end of war"
Plato
Greek author & philosopher in Athens (427 BC - 347 BC)

https://www.facebook.com/WW2-Greek-Army ... 751753340/


Last edited by Gio on Wed Apr 24, 2013 22:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:54 pm 
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Thank goodness my girlfriend's mother is an expert tailor then! lol.

Well it seems the trousers are very similar to British SD...tho I'm no expert on SD if I'm honest.

Seems with the tunic you have the shoulder tabs (if you wish, I know this is debated) and buttons ect. Will obviously need to look at photos carefully. Then I'm presuming you'd have to dye the uniform itself or something to make it more olive green?

So British SD is not necessarily incorrect (especially if you change the buttons) but obviously alot more rarer than you would perceive? I guess from a starting the impression point of view its not bad but obviously the idea should be to try and change and improve it as and when you can?

Sorry if I'm sending this round in circles. Never handled any of this stuff first hand and most of my knowledge has been achieved from my own limited research and logically thinking. Want to go to Greece and experience this all first hand but being a student, thats very difficult. lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Greek Army 1940-41
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 15:46 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 16:14 pm
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There is not much to do to tunic except remove the patches and change the buttons , the color is not olive , it is khaki brown.
Now the trousers are different story ,you need to converse the trousers into breeches as shown above and i believe you are good to go, at least that is what our team is doing.

_________________
"Only the dead have seen the end of war"
Plato
Greek author & philosopher in Athens (427 BC - 347 BC)

https://www.facebook.com/WW2-Greek-Army ... 751753340/


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