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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 18:25 pm 
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and Calzoni ( a zampa d'elefante :) )
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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 20:46 pm 
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Found this interesting illustration. Seems to have a Summer insignia on his sleeve. Looks like a drafted leading seaman ( Sottocapo Marinai di Leva ). Wondered if the san marco had Navy ranks or Army ones? Maybe unlike the Brit RMs they had Navy ranks and grades. Haven't seen any rank badges in photos though!! Looks like a white 2 in a black square above, prob 2nd btn. Dunno what the red badge under the webbing on right is?
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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:47 am 
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Real Name: Andy
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Interesting new kit you have there Mike!

Hope I can score some soon too :(

The rank insignia question is a good one, I've not seen much in the way of any insignia so far worn by anyone!

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 8:00 am 
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Real Name: Neil Lawrence
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Nice uniform there Mike, How's the fit?

I think the San Marco had Naval ranks, as opposed to Army style ones. I certainly know that the San Marco Para Batt. had differing insignia to Army para's, so the rest should follow.

Now the red insignia could be the Traditional San Marco 'Mostrine', normally applied to Officers lapels, but the San Marco also wore a sleeve version, normally placed at the cuffs. This consists of a Small red rectangle, with the winged lion within it, embroidered in yellow thread.

I've got to say, i'm looking forward to seeing some San Marco at shows next year!!!

Neil

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IF, and only IF, there is a war, we may provide you with a camouflage hood or cap in times of wet weather (Quote from the 1936 drill manual for the REI)


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Telo Tenda Mimetico Modello 1929. Keeping Farbs dry at night since 1978

Its a Tent! Its a Poncho! Its a Ground Sheet! Its a Camouflage against the enemy. My word, its even a waterproof sleeping bag! It is not, however, German.

M33 Elmetto. Good against shrapnel. Great for grinding coffee. For that superb sweat encrusted taste.[/size]
http://ww2italianreenactment.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:52 am 
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SuperMario wrote:
Now the red insignia could be the Traditional San Marco 'Mostrine', normally applied to Officers lapels, but the San Marco also wore a sleeve version, normally placed at the cuffs. This consists of a Small red rectangle, with the winged lion within it, embroidered in yellow thread.


I did wonder if it was that, but it didn't look the right place - looked like worn on the breast in that pic... could be the usual problem with the artist not understanding what he is seeing...

I have the cuff insignia 8) just need the damned uniform!

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I've got to say, i'm looking forward to seeing some San Marco at shows next year!!!


Me too! :D

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 15:11 pm 
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Hi guys, yep I'm really pleased it fits like it was made for me. Slightly long in the leg that's all. :)

I think you're right about the insignia Neil, came across this photo, showing Navy rank badge and winged Lion badge on the cuff. I suppose that would be a winter uniform, same colour as the Navy? I think the polo neck jerseys are great. 8) I want one, I want one I want one....
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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 18:42 pm 
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The Winter uniform is grey green in colour. Same as Army really. Its a great look though. this thread just gets better and better. So much info and pics on here, alot i have never seen before!

Now, are you after some of those cuff insignia Mike......?

Neil

_________________
MAI DAUR!

IF, and only IF, there is a war, we may provide you with a camouflage hood or cap in times of wet weather (Quote from the 1936 drill manual for the REI)


Image

Telo Tenda Mimetico Modello 1929. Keeping Farbs dry at night since 1978

Its a Tent! Its a Poncho! Its a Ground Sheet! Its a Camouflage against the enemy. My word, its even a waterproof sleeping bag! It is not, however, German.

M33 Elmetto. Good against shrapnel. Great for grinding coffee. For that superb sweat encrusted taste.[/size]
http://ww2italianreenactment.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 19:26 pm 
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SuperMario wrote:
The Winter uniform is grey green in colour. Same as Army really. Its a great look though. this thread just gets better and better. So much info and pics on here, alot i have never seen before!

Now, are you after some of those cuff insignia Mike......?

Neil


Certainly am and the grey green winter uniform and the polo neck jersey. :)

I'm getting more and more enthusiastic about doing this and have been spending a lot of time looking for info and stuff. I'm in contact with Remo and the moment about all sorts, including regia marina. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 20:26 pm 
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Real Name: Neil Lawrence
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Here you go Mike,

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Coppia-Leoni-per-polsi-Decima-MAS-Truppa-Xa-MAS_W0QQitemZ300237472417QQihZ020QQcategoryZ36070QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

One set of repro San Marco Lions for ya!

I will say one thing for Remo, he is probably the best at getting the right stuff for people. Hong Kong can produce cheap stuff, but for quality and accuracy, you can't beat him.

Neil

_________________
MAI DAUR!

IF, and only IF, there is a war, we may provide you with a camouflage hood or cap in times of wet weather (Quote from the 1936 drill manual for the REI)


Image

Telo Tenda Mimetico Modello 1929. Keeping Farbs dry at night since 1978

Its a Tent! Its a Poncho! Its a Ground Sheet! Its a Camouflage against the enemy. My word, its even a waterproof sleeping bag! It is not, however, German.

M33 Elmetto. Good against shrapnel. Great for grinding coffee. For that superb sweat encrusted taste.[/size]
http://ww2italianreenactment.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 21:37 pm 
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Thanks for that Neil, just bought 'em. A very nice addition they'll be too.
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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 22:36 pm 
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Cool 8)

Any idea about whether the naval rank insignia is worn on the khaki version?

And of course the obvious question about where such insignia might be found...

I noticed the latest photo from Mike, that guy's helmet is lacking the Regia Marina stencil on the front.... I've also not yet seen the decal in a photo - like the helmet I found on ebay.

Is that decal a post-armistice thing or something?

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 22:51 pm 
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Thought I'd check out Wehrmacht Awards for some more info...

Found this thread (and another linked from it)

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/ ... =san+marco

Some good pics and descriptions of the web gear and also a photo showing the cuff insignia on a khaki uniform and a lot showing the rollneck jumper too. Wonder what colour that was?

A lot of the desert pics show them wearing just a white t-shirt - presumably a plain cotton job?

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 22:53 pm 
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Dunno Andy,

not seen a photo of a helmet with a stencil and I have been looking. Also only seen the illustration I posted with a rank badge on the Khaki, I suppose it must have been drawn from a photo, but I'm not too keen on taking that as a ref.

The Navy rank/trade badges are very similar to modern day ones. Look on Ebay.it and search for marina militare ( modern italian navy - used from 1946 I think). Be careful as not all are the same, luckily I've a 1943 reference book. The regia marina wore the badges on both arms.

The decal may be a post armistice, I think the helmet picture you posted was R.S.I. (the badge on the side), which may be a clue. Although the Osprey illustration shows an anchor with a crown above.

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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 22:57 pm 
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Looking at the link I just posted, seems those ammo pouches come in singles or blocks of three all sewn together, which would explain how they attach...

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 22:57 pm 
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Orders were issued in 1940, that helmet stencils were to be removed, so as to not notify the enemy who you were. the same goes for the arm shields, and with some units (the Folgore in particular) the Mostrine... (another subject, we'll go into that on the Folgore thread).

.... However, most helmets produced before this date seem to have retained their stencil. We know this because so many still exist. there is every likely hood that in a unit, some had stencils, some had not.

be aware that these are sprayed on, not Decals (You will find places that sell them... steer clear, its the road to farby town), and for the RM, you'll need the fouled anchor with crown. The Helmet colour is open to debate (see other threads) but the stencil is definately yellow.

Neil

_________________
MAI DAUR!

IF, and only IF, there is a war, we may provide you with a camouflage hood or cap in times of wet weather (Quote from the 1936 drill manual for the REI)


Image

Telo Tenda Mimetico Modello 1929. Keeping Farbs dry at night since 1978

Its a Tent! Its a Poncho! Its a Ground Sheet! Its a Camouflage against the enemy. My word, its even a waterproof sleeping bag! It is not, however, German.

M33 Elmetto. Good against shrapnel. Great for grinding coffee. For that superb sweat encrusted taste.[/size]
http://ww2italianreenactment.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Reenacting San Marco
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 23:03 pm 
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Neil,

I meant a decal on the side... like the one I showed above (somewhere!)... the RM emblem on the front is definitely stenciled on all the photos I've seen so far, but thanks for the "decal farb" issue highlight :D

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"I saw cities in Europe that were practically untouched by the war, countries that capitulated to the more powerful enemies even before war was declared, but we are not like that. Our grandfathers, our fathers, our older generation, our great leaders, fought here for each building, for each street." - First Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin on the 70th anniversary of victory at Stalingrad


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